Episode 108
How Steven Navigated ADD In His UX Job Search and Got Hired As a Design Researcher
20 min listen
Episode 106
20 min listen
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Episode Summary
Feeling overwhelmed or directionless in your UX job search? In this episode, you’ll hear how a Career Strategy Lab alumni, Steven Durgin, transitioned from uncertainty about his next UX career move to getting hired as a Design Researcher and then launching his own UX research agency, Affinity UX. After working in podcast production and facilitating masterminds for people in startups and other entrepreneurial ventures, Steven realized he’d been developing UX research skills without the official title of UX Researcher. That’s when Steven decided to pursue a career in UX Research.
In the episode, Steven reflects on his journey, from overcoming self-doubt as a career switcher to building confidence, leveraging mentorship, and creating a sustainable business model. Sarah and Steven explore the role of community, structured career tools, and storytelling in navigating the UX job search and scaling an agency.
Steven opens up about his struggles with ADD (Attention Deficit Disorder) and how he leveraged the structured support and community at Career Strategy Lab to build a bias towards action. Steven said that the structure of Career Strategy Lab’s UX job search accelerator helped him avoid procrastination and make the switch to UX research and ultimately starting his own UX research agency.
Tune in to hear actionable tips on UX resumes, the power of storytelling, and the importance of community in career development.
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Discussion Questions About The Episode
- Reflecting on your own career journey, how have you managed self-doubt or uncertainty in your professional pursuits, and what strategies have helped you overcome these challenges?
- Considering the importance of community mentioned in the episode, how has being part of a professional network or support group influenced your career development and decision-making?
- Reflect on the concept of building in public as discussed. How comfortable are you with sharing your career progress and challenges openly, and what benefits or challenges have you experienced from doing so?
- Steve discusses the impact of a "compass statement" in guiding career decisions. How do you define your own "compass" in your career, and how does it inform the choices you make about job applications, projects, and professional development?
Episode Notes & Links
Episode Transcript
Sarah Doody [00:00:00]: With the Compass statement, it helps serve as that north star so that when it is time to decide what bullet points do I put on my resume, what projects do I put in my portfolio, what could I highlight in a cover letter? Or which jobs should I even apply to or entertain? It makes all of those decisions so much easier because you have this kind of filter to run all those decisions through.
Sarah Doody [00:00:30]: Hey there. I’m Sarah Doody, host of the career strategy podcast. Many professionals are seeking more impact, flexibility, growth, and let’s face it, getting paid what they’re worth. But how how do you unlock this in your career? It starts with strategy. I’m taking you behind the scenes of what’s working for my career coaching clients. You’ll hear strategies and actionable, yet sometimes against the grain, advice for how you can be the CEO of your career and stop dreading Mondays. Ready to level up your career? Let’s get after
Erin Lindstrom [00:01:07]: it. Hey. This is Erin. I am one of the coaches inside of career strategy lab, and I want to let you know that this episode you’re about to listen to, number 1 is awesome, and number 2 is actually from our open house. So in this conversation, you should know that there were other people on this call and there was a live audience. So if some of the editing seems a little bit weird or abrupt that’s why. It should still make sense for you. There’s so many gems of wisdom to grab from this episode.
Erin Lindstrom [00:01:33]: So we hope you enjoy and if you do like this format where you really can get to know someone and learn more about their career journey, please let us know. You can send Sarah a LinkedIn message or you can email hello at sarahdudy.com. We love the feedback and we wanna create more of what you enjoy and find helpful. Alright. Let’s get into the episode.
Sarah Doody [00:01:52]: Alright. Also, I’ve been told you cannot hear the chickens in the background, but I’m currently in Hawaii, and the chickens decided to come and announce themselves. They’re actually really beautiful. We could pick up on, like, where to find UX jobs and and how you found Jira’s because I know referrals were a big one. LinkedIn, love it or hate it, is big also. But, Steven, we are doing quick intros, telling people what you were doing before you landed in career strategy lab and what you are doing now. And I know that you got hired, Steven, and then you also went down the the consulting path. So give us kind of the the the lowdown on your before and after.
Steve Durgin [00:02:36]: Sure. I’m sorry for my delay in joining. I am here. Problem. I’m glad I’m so glad to be here and seeing you all again. I feel like
Sarah Doody [00:02:43]: crossing oceans. I’m in Hawaii, and you’re in Spain. So, yeah, confusing.
Steve Durgin [00:02:47]: That is a time difference for sure. Yeah.
Sarah Doody [00:02:49]: Yeah. It’s 11 in the morning here.
Steve Durgin [00:02:52]: Excellent. Wow. That’s the opposite. 10 PM here. Yeah. I mean, I was confused coming into CSL. Like, should I be a career switcher or a climber? And that continues to be a paradox of expressing myself in different contexts today. Depending on the career space that I’m in, it makes more sense to highlight that I’m more senior or that I’m more junior.
Steve Durgin [00:03:13]: I was, essentially doing UX without realizing it for a while, then got trained in it a bit more, but was in a start up space that was actually a coaching community and facilitating masterminds for groups of people across different disciplines. Was also in podcasting and media and was starting to use my UX research skills to help, shore up and grow a podcast network that’s still doing great today. And so, I came with a lot of timidity and, self doubt because those are largely self created spaces that I was a part of, and so it’s very it was very hard for me to know, like, how do I actually stack up compared to, for example, big tech to your point. And so yeah. Do you want me to do a short bit on where I am now or or what
Sarah Doody [00:03:58]: you want? We would we would love that. Yeah.
Steve Durgin [00:04:00]: Okay. Yeah. So came into CSL very much in that state of self doubt. Got a huge confidence boost, a lot of support with critique and and getting career materials into a better shape. And really, one of the big, moves was learning how to ask people to mentor me. And one of those went really well. And not only did he say yes to mentoring me for a period of time, but because I was so on his radar and because that opened the door for us to have a stronger connection, he thought of me when an opportunity came up for a short term project. And that led to 4 more research sprints with them, which then led to me feeling like I could probably do this even if there aren’t more agency gigs right away ready for me, and sometimes I still go and take a gig with them, but, and with other agencies.
Steve Durgin [00:04:50]: But, yeah, it’s it was a huge shift for me and just, like, realizing, like, oh, yeah. Like, I have certain areas of strength and and I could run an end to end project, and so let’s try it. And so started that and, as far as a team based model, not just solo freelance, really a year and a month ago. So, yeah, here we are. We’re still doing good, doing better. We’re scaling. We’re hiring a little bit. So that’s cool.
Steve Durgin [00:05:15]: I never knew I would get this far, so I feel very lucky.
Sarah Doody [00:05:19]: And so now you’re exclusively doing the agency route as in your own agency. Yeah. That’s amazing.
Steve Durgin [00:05:28]: Yeah. I mean, it’s it’s so hard to even explain the whirlwind that it that it feels like, and I’m sure you understand it as someone who has built your own thing. I think that will and so it stretches me in every direction. I love the challenge. I love the energy. I I feel extremely privileged to have amazing people in my life to help me with it. But, yeah, it’s it’s been wonderful. And now we have a couple what I call miracle clients.
Steve Durgin [00:05:51]: And so that’s the client that brings you other clients so you don’t have to sell as much. And so that’s been a game changer to allow me to focus on other aspects of making sure that we’re doing everything well. So Yeah.
Sarah Doody [00:06:02]: Yeah. Yeah. I think it’s so easy to just jump into rush mode, and I need to update my resume. I need to go to coffee meetups. I need to go to in person online meetups. I need to update my portfolio, all of the things that you kind of end up just running around like a, no pun intended, like a chicken with its head cut off as we were talking about the chickens here in Hawaii. But with the compass statement, it helps serve as, like, that north star so that when it is time to decide what bullet points do I put on my resume, what projects do I put in my portfolio, What could I highlight in a cover letter? Or which jobs should I even apply to or entertain? It makes all of those decisions so much easier because you have this kind of filter to run all those decisions through?
Steve Durgin [00:06:56]: Filter was huge. I think scarcity is such a powerful, like, psychological force, and there’s nothing like a difficult, just like sprint of getting rejections in the job search, like like 1%, you know, response rate type of a deal, for how long can any healthy person even sustain that even if everything else in their life was going great. And so even having a space where qualified people could kind of look at these statements with me and help me process through, like, is this even sensible? Should I be thinking that, you know, I should, you know, be selective about what I applied to was extremely helpful? And the answer is yes. You should be selective. But it is hard to be selective when you feel like you’re grasping at straws. And but I do think it serves everyone better in the long run. You’re more likely to get something that you actually are a better fit for. So focusing that energy is just, like, such a hard muscle, still for me to figure out, but it was helpful.
Sarah Doody [00:07:57]: And one thing that I remember you mentioned, Steven, maybe you don’t remember it, but I just read over some stuff before this call that you had said, you know, you were worried because you didn’t feel like you had a lot of connections in UX industry, really. You’re kind of this self taught career switcher, let’s say. And I think, like, the power of the community to rapidly expand your network to help you not only just grow as a professional, but also create connections that I’m not sure if anyone in in CSL helped you find your job, but I think everyone would be curious to know kind of the impact of CSL on helping you, you know, grow that network that kind of didn’t exist in your case.
Steve Durgin [00:08:48]: Yeah. So I I you know, for me, I’m an extrovert. I’m a social learner. I’m a practical learner. I think a lot of people are that way. And so the ability to have access to a space suddenly where I’m constantly able to access and just kind of learn from people as they talk about, like, the commonalities and the differences in their work. It’s like a amazing just accelerated education for me. And just quickly, you sort out that, like, oh, I mean, it only takes so much time of hearing people troubleshoot and problem solve and move from problem to solution that you you start to feel more confidence and more equipped to be able to use those as streams of reference and and solve some problems yourself.
Steve Durgin [00:09:28]: And so I certainly felt that that type of equipping and confidence, was, you know, increased pretty fast. And now I feel super comfortable talking to people in this space regardless of domain experience, regardless of seniority. And I I also think there was just kind of a honestly, as a younger and, like, newer to the field person, I just felt like there was a sort of recognition that everybody’s human that hit me harder in a space like CSL where people are very transparent and supportive of each other. And people that I just thought, well, there’s no way I can compete with you. You’re incredible. You know, you have all the stuff that has sticker value, FANG experience, etcetera. And, you know, sometimes those folks would be really vulnerable. And that was really actually encouraging and helpful for me, because it was like, oh, the the challenges don’t go away.
Steve Durgin [00:10:17]: They just kind of shape shift. First of all, I’m always like, oh, I should be older. And then all the old folks come into the group, and they’re like, we should be younger. And like, you know, everyone has 1,000 reasons to sort of think that they’re disqualified from whatever their next career move is. But, yeah, I think it just sort of depressurized all of that and gave me good exposure to to different, you know, walks and, chapters of life.
Sarah Doody [00:10:41]: Yeah. The one thing that kinda struck me with your answer is, you know, there’s that hashtag or movement, like, build in public. Right? And I think in the job search and in advancing our careers, oftentimes, that is not a very public thing. Right? A lot of people kind of stay in a in a silo when it comes to their resume and their LinkedIn and job search and and all that. And what we keep hearing over and over is very similar to what you just described, like the ability to no longer do this all in a silo on your own and have a community, I think, helps so much with accountability, first of all. Right? But, also, the kinda confidence level setting, if you will, and that you realize, hey. This isn’t just me. I’m not the only person that struggles with x y z.
Sarah Doody [00:11:43]: No matter how many years of experience, no matter what amazing company names you have on your resume, everyone struggles with this stuff because it’s not something we have to do every day. And, yeah, it is it can be intimidating. But when you step out of that silo and do it kind of in community, I think there’s such empowerment with that. And I’m curious for any of you or, like, if you have anything else around the idea of, like, the community and how it maybe impacted you, whether it’s accountability or who knows what. And, Steven, I’m I’m curious because although what you did in career strategy lab helped you get hired into those consulting roles, I’m very curious. In hindsight, now that you have your own agency and you are needing to communicate to potential clients, how your agency can help them, etcetera, Are there things from career strategy lab that you’ve been able to leverage and tweak as you look at how do I market and sell my agency to to people? And I I will not be offended if you say no, but we’re just we’re curious, to see if anything translated from, you know, getting hired into a full time job versus going a freelancer route or agency route.
Steve Durgin [00:13:13]: Yeah. That’s that’s a great question. I think in an indirect way, CSL really helped with structuring my thoughts around what has become my proposal process for a written proposal to submit to businesses once the conversation gets to that point. And it it would take a bit for me to try to pull together all the threads and articulate in, like, a useful concise way.
Sarah Doody [00:13:32]: Right.
Steve Durgin [00:13:32]: Like, how it is that you guys have helped me with that, to be honest with you. It’s a very creative question. So
Sarah Doody [00:13:38]: Maybe it’s another interview. But, yeah, tell us what you have right now.
Steve Durgin [00:13:43]: What I’ve what I’ve got right now is is that there are patterns of communication that are skills we can all grow in, and I think the the power of these skills is greater than ever, in a space that already has a lot of noise in it. When you’re just in a difficult market, storytelling is everything. And so the iterative process of getting critiques, for example, on my portfolio materials and, like, watching somebody through Loom, like, experience or reexperience, like, a slide or, you know, one section of a project and realizing all of a sudden, it’s like light user testing. It’s like, oh my goodness. I was so in my head about this while trying to write and massage all these words. Now I can see somebody process it, and the same themes emerge. Bottom line up front, concision, no more than this many words per slide is ideal. Use, you know, callouts and visuals, but minimally so that it’s not too loud and crowded.
Steve Durgin [00:14:35]: And I’m not a designer. Some folks in this community are incredible designers. But but even being able to sort of shore up applying some of those principles over and over, it just kind of built the muscles for me. And so I wouldn’t say that my proposals are super concise. It depends on the business I’m pitching them to, but it uses a lot of the same visual hierarchy, bullet points, you know, all these types of simple things that I think are more refined now and help me when I need to explain the value of a project to a stakeholder who’s all of a sudden hopping on the meeting and being brought in the loop on something.
Sarah Doody [00:15:09]: And I I think one thing that strikes me about you, Steven, you’re a researcher. You’re also a storyteller and communicator from your podcast experience. And, you know, when it comes to, like, the design of your resume, the design of your portfolio, or the writing of your resume, the writing of your portfolio, you know, you may have thought, oh, I’ve got this. But it’s hard when you’re doing it for yourself. Right? And I think that the sooner you can recognize that, the faster you can kind of stop massaging words and designs based on what you think is necessary and see it through the lens of that recruiter, that hiring manager who has minutes or seconds, and design and create content for them versus what, you know, your bar is. One thing I kinda wanna end on is what advice or words would you have for anyone that might be on the fence about joining Career Strategy Lab? And if there’s any advice you have about how to succeed in Career Strategy Lab, I’m sure they would welcome that also.
Steve Durgin [00:16:28]: I mean, this is not, I don’t think, a slight. I would say, you know, I don’t think that and maybe things have changed since. I don’t think that CSL for me, like, the value of CSL was that it was revolutionary in some sort of, like, you know, pure value add content or techniques or secrets or whatever. Like, I I think it provided the supports and the structures and the step by step checklists to help me to develop a bias toward action. And still, statistically, that is the most significant factor that sets apart anyone when it comes to measurable performance categories. So if you have a bias towards action and you can cultivate that further and put supports in place that help you, like in my case, I struggle with pretty, you know, severe ADD and was unmedicated only until just a year ago. And, like, it put the pressure on more than ever to try to figure out things that I can do, environmental factors, social factors, things that I can set up to prompt me, remind me, motivate me. And so I don’t I don’t think I missed more than one opportunity to submit a critique because I was like, I’m gonna get that critique even if I’ve only changed something 5%, because, you know, that was just something that motivated me to leverage, you know, the full value of the experience.
Steve Durgin [00:17:45]: And so if someone’s on the fence and it sounds like you resonate with that, I would just encourage you to take the jump because theoretically, sure, someone could try to pull together and simulate and recreate, what this community does on their own steam. It would be exhausting. It would be difficult even if you’re a natural networker like me, even if you’re extremely extroverted, even if you have facilitation experience, and you have a great small writing group that meets every week like I did, and they’re all professionals, and they can pivot into being your coaches. Like, you can try to build all this and make it happen around you, but in in almost, you know, 99% of cases, I would recommend you don’t try to do that. Even if you have a propensity to try to start things from scratch like I do, that can work against you when you may just need some community or human, you know, that’s what we need.
Sarah Doody [00:18:33]: Alright. I think that’s all we have time for. So I wanna first say thank you, Steven, for graciously giving their time and answering tons of questions. So that’s it. I hope you have a great rest of your day, and we will talk
Sarah Doody [00:18:50]: to you soon. Thanks for listening to the career strategy podcast. Make sure to follow me, Sarah Doody, on Twitter, Instagram, YouTube, or LinkedIn. If anything in today’s episode resonated with you, I’d love to hear about it. Tag me on social media or send me a DM. And lastly, if you found this episode helpful, I’d really appreciate it if you could share it with a friend or give us a quick rating on Spotify or review on Apple Podcasts. Catch you later.